Métro - Discussion générale

Transport en commun Métro
2428

On banalise l’usage de drogues et les mauvais comportement c’est une spirale infernal. Désolé tu fait du trouble ce n’est pas acceptable. Les états-unis on perdu le control a beaucoup d’endroit surtout en Californie. Un vol de marchandise en bas de 950$ la police n’intervient même pas. C’est comme dire au voyous allez y rien ne vas vous arriver.

A Madrid dans toutes les stations de metros il y a des vigilencias. (Gardien de sécurité). A Paris aussi j’ai vu beaucoup de control de sécurité avec des agents.

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2429

While i do agree that repression shouldn’t be the first solution, everything needs to have a limit. What is going on right now in New York is a shining exemple of what happens when you let crime go unpunished. Criminals know that theft bellow a certain amount is only lightly punished, and so, they feel no fear of getting caught. They are emboldened. A number of stores have had no choice other than to close. This includes large chain stores.

Whatever it is that we decide to do about homeless peoples in the metro, the current situation simply cannot be allowed to continue. We shouldn’t be shy about banning peoples who harass passagers, make them feel unsafe, or use hard drugs in the metro. Private building owners would never allow that kind of situation to go unchecked.

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2430

My question then is where’s the city’s dedicated spot for people to take hard drugs without any repercussions or to litter needles all over the floor while defecating. Yet we let the metro be this place… It’s taking money we could use to improve the network to deal with stuff that’s absolutely of no use.

If we really want to not make it as bad, why could we not just do like square Cabot but for every metro station? Only 1 access allowed with police blocking the homeless from entering at all?

If a homeless was loitering on my property i would use the police to teesspass them. Why can’t we do the same with the metro or use deterrence to not have to utilize the police?

Winter is not a new concept, the city of Montreal already use the aglomeration funds to deal with this but we can clearly see it’s not actually working.

2431

While true, you know what else will end up killing someone? Letting people under the influence of drugs harrass, and eventually stab someone to death on the metro due to lack of intervention.

It’s a fine line to deal with, since both ends result in potential deaths, whether from letting someone onto the curb, or someone violently stabbing someone on the metro.

I feel like getting kicked to the curb SHOULD be acceptable only with violent behaviour (especially repeated). Otherwise, of course not.

2432

If someone is partaking in violent behavior they dont get kicked to the curb, they go to jail, which notably is sheltered and provides food. What constitutes violence is a different problem, but alot of the things mentioned in this thread (drug use, yelling, etc.) While uncomfortable, are not violent.

Now, if you think that increased policing and crackdowns will solve this, i will point you to the fact that over the years policing has only increased, with the SPVM now having the highest police expenditure per capita in Canada, and yet the problem only keeps on getting worse.

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2433

Safe injection sites (or hell, even needle drop boxes like the ones being trialed at some stations) and public toilets are both things that can solve this problem. It is absolutely irresponsible to suggest that subjecting people to further suffering is the only way forward.

This is famously not a winning strategy, considering that atwater still has homeless people in the station. Also, do you really want to give the police the power to decide who gets to use a metro station based on wether they “look homeless”? A police force that has been notorious for its profiling and discrimination?

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2434

Simple check they have an active opus card with a fare they will use

And could we please just kick out everyone at closing time? Metro is closed, no reason to be in the metro at all

2435

Under this system, any new user (tourist, newcomer, etc.) or even anyone who uses the metro infrequently and dosent see the need for an opus card will not be allowed into the metro.

Also, I can garuntee that many of the homeless you see in stations would meet your criteria. A monthly zone A pass is alot cheaper than housing.

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2436

Still not a reason to use the metro as any refuge, the amount of money they fraud the CMM every time they chose to go in the tunel and close the lifeblood of a metropole, it should be a blanket ban, no homeless in the metro, and loud noise is a way that does not hurt them physically to leave. And they are technically tresspassing and tresspassing normally means removal

2437

As I mentioned before, a blanket ban on homelessness in the metro would be incredibly dificult to enforce, as well as probably facing some human rights lawsuits (they still have the right to use public transportation, after all)

You are engaging with this problem on a very superficial level. The question should not be “what can we do about homeless people in the metro”, it should be “what can we do about homelessness?” While I recognize that the answer to that question lies outside the subject of this thread, it is still irresponsible to pretend like we can solve this problem with a blanket ban. All of your “solutions” fall apart at any kind of scrutiny, and would just result in more targeted police violence against an already vulnerable population. I am reminded of the old adage “when all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail”. I would suggest you read more about different approaches to solving homelessness.

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2438

Interesting. I was under the impression that it was nearly impossible to recuperate the salaries of fare enforcement personelle. I know that at least in New York City, the added revenue from fines and fares doesn’t come close to the cost.

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2439

…we already do that. At close time, homeless folks are walked back to the exits. No one is allowed inside the stations apart from staff.

I’m not sure if you’re talking simply about people doing fare evasion to take refuge inside the station or actually going inside the tunnels between stations. The latter is a fairly marginal phenomenon, and there is no proof that the culprits are homeless or not or paid their fares or not.

As for fare evasion, it is not something that is solely done by homeless folks, FAR from that. People from all walks of life do it - youths, adults, poor, rich. Spend an hour at a subway station or ask staff and you will see there’s no typical profile for a person who does it. Hell, even myself I will admit I’ve done it before when I was in a rush and ran out of tickets and did not have the time to buy some new ones. I’m not proud of it, but it’s ultimately peanuts considering how much in the red the STM is finance wise.

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2440

Je voudrais rappeler qu’un jeune de 16 ans a été tuer par un crackhead dans le metro de Toronto l’an passé.

Ya des foutu limites.

Le probleme ce n’est pas ceux qui ne paye pas le metro. Le danger c’est les coucou avec des problemes mentaux et ceux qui sont intoxiqué.

Ca coutera ce que ca coutera que l’on mette plus d’agent de sécurité dans le métro.
Plusieurs autres endroit dans le monde le fontf. Faut arreter d’imaginer que l’on peut rentabiliser d’une maniere ou d’une autre avec des billets d’infraction. La securité des uttilisateurs du transport en commun doit primer.

Les droits de ceux qui se drogue et font du trouble doit passer en deuxieme.

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2441

i ment kicked to NEVER return. they take a photo or something and let them know they can NEVER return (unless they get there life together and stop being homeless)

2442

Et vous pensez que mettre plus de police dans le metro a pas des consequences? Je vous rapelle que plusieurs personnes ont ete blesse par un fusillade irresponsible des policiers a New York en octobre

Les problemes qui vous mentionne, l’intoxication de drogue et les problemes mentale, sont des problemes avec des solución medicales et sociales, pas criminels. Si la personne est en train d’attaque ou menacer les autres, ça c’est quand ca devient un probleme criminel.

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2443

On peut débattre sans coller des étiquettes aux autres participants. Un argument se tient par sa force.

Si on se sent frustré dans le débat, c’est signe de prendre une pause. C’est un sujet sensible et il y a une discussion intéressante, et si on veut que ça contenu, maintenons le ton neutre.

Peu importe les idées des gens, c’est clair que tout le monde veut régler un problème complexe.

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2444

Its very obvious that either you’ve never actually spoken with a homeless person. I’ve met homeless people with masters degrees, people who owned businesses. The fact that you think they can simply “get their life together” and leave this situation demonstrates how little you know about what you talk about, and is quite frankly incredibly arrogant. For your own sake I truly do hope that others show you compassion if you ever fall on hard times, perhaps you can learn by example.

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2445

this is basically impossible to enforce

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2446

First @vincemtl if i somehow cross a line please lmk so i can rectify just in case.

Thing is every time i pass next to one, it’s either a drunk begger, a violent individual, someone who lost a limb due to narcotics or someone who is naked and harassing people and i have to go out of my way to avoid them. I have a step daughter visiting the country next year and i don’t want her to see those atrocities. Why should we allow this kind of horror to be viewed in the eyes of childrens or anyone tbh?

Those who try to get back on their feets will seek help. Those who just don’t care are the problem makers that haunt the metro non stop.

I don’t see a reason why it’s the responsibility of basically the transport Minister to deal with problems from the health ministry. In the provincial and federal levels the homeless issue would not even be touched by the transport ministries at all, they would dump the issue onto the health ministry. Why in The city of Montreal should we then instead have the transport division deal with a health division department issue?

I don’t want fire fighters to work on the powerlines nor do i want linemen’s fighting fires.

Ever since the STM has had there hotline i have to make roughly 5 reports each time i take a metro for drug smoking homeless individuals or violent individuals or people sleeping in the emergency exits blocking the entire emergency pathway or people literally urinating onto the tracks.

This should not be the situation in a transportation complex.

We have literal excels of names of people who have been problem making for years (one example: Le mancho at CV… Urines every day in the elevators, will block the escalators demanding for money and will scream and rip your stuff off you and lug it onto the tracks if you don’t pay him. He lost an arm because he kept injecting HARD drugs in that arm…) that’s just 1 guy who literally have a name to be easier to identify to the security. Theres a list of MANY problematic people who just will never recover and who makes the metro a horror place.

Why should i have to smell urine and feeces every time i take an elevator? Why could we not make then listen to harsh noise 24/7?

Why you think we closed square cabot? Because it was used EXCLUSIVELY by homeless people because it was too dangerous for commuters

They even regularly break the red fare gates because that’s the easy way in by forcing them… Those gates are the only way for accessibility users to enter the metro. I don’t see how having a broken gate basically making a station inaccessible is a good thing for the STM while having homeless people who breaks them stay in on a daily basis is also a good thing

In winter the increasingly climbing amount of times this happens is another big problem that needs to somehow get solved…

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I will be making another access to info request to know on a station per station this winter again and ad onto that the amount of suicides this winter… Because it’s too much

I’ll probably tac on this year the ammount of homeless expulsion they did to keep track of this…

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2447

Moi ce que je me rappele surtout du metro de new york c’est le coucou qui a mit le feu a une dame qui est morte brulée vive.

On va en échapper peut être avec des policiers qui ont un mauvais comportement mais eux ont une liability si je peut me permettre l’anglicisme.

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